New Mushkin Memory Heat Spreaders

killswitch83 · Post by **killswitch83** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 7:27 am

Well, to start with, look a little further up on the thread, Apop explains that the increase in surface area is due to the fact the heatspreader doesn't touch the top of the PCB, and the fancy little cutouts at the top, both combined,makes the 58% increased surface area; remember, the devil's in the details, which is why I'm glad we have someone like Apop who has good consumer relations with RAM manufacturers, he can find out the dirt on a lot of things. The thing that's funny is that if you take a look at the OCZ PC4800+ Platinum, it runs 3-5-5-10 at 600Mhz and
2-2-2-5 at 400 Mhz, personally I would just get lower speed Platinum (400 Mhz) and try to lower that latency, especially since soon the mainstreaming of RAM watercooling blocks will come to the US (you may already have that product out in Ireland, I don't know). That's what I like about OCZ, they have TCCD chips, so you know they can take some juice and much lower latencies than rated.

kenc51 · Post by **kenc51** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 7:44 am

True
I read the earlier posts
I ment to say "i still cannot SEE the difference"
As mentioned, There is prob a 58% increase, Just cannot SEE it!

Watercooled Ram is not here in Ireland yet, In fact there is only 1 shop in Ireland which supply water cooling gear. Its a mate of mine and does only Innovatek stuff,
You may not have heard of Innovatek, german company, designs are for 3/8 hosing --> great performance tough
Fair play to Nate for his contacts

I never knew you can add more volts to TCCD??
I always tought they we good for upto 2.8v?

I have very early TCCD, I got my ram B4 anandtech came out with thier review (which is when people realised how fast they can go)
http://www.anandtech.com/memory/showdoc.aspx?i=2145&p=6

Do early TCCD chips scale well with volts?
I'm using a stock p4p800 so can only goto ~2.8v
I can get it to run 2.5,3,3,5 @ 250 - this is the max for me?
not sure if the ram can do more as @ limit of proc
Might keep this ram for my X2 setup (whenever i can afford it)
Mayby I'll win the contest for the 3200Gold VX

my last word on h2o cooling ram
http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/other/disp ... 10949.html The companies HAVE the capability to test for higher speeds with higher volts

infinitevalence · Post by **infinitevalence** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 9:42 am

TCCD does not see much improvement with voltage over 3v some time even over 2.8v. The key with TCCD and TCC5 is that if you lossen up the timmings they will hit very very high frequencies some people are hitting 300+ on TCCD.

killswitch83 · Post by **killswitch83** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 9:49 am

well, the OCZ 3200 Platinum Rev. 2 has excellent timings @ 557 DDR (and stock timing, according to OCZ's website, is actually 2-2-2-5 in the rev. 2, though I don't believe they were testing the EL RAM, so I'm pretty sure the clock on this RAM will be lower than what was tested. As for yours ken, what brand are you running? I don't think you stated that earlier.

kenc51 · Post by **kenc51** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 10:17 am

killswitch83 wrote:well, the OCZ 3200 Platinum Rev. 2 has excellent timings @ 557 DDR (and stock timing, according to OCZ's website, is actually 2-2-2-5 in the rev. 2, though I don't believe they were testing the EL RAM, so I'm pretty sure the clock on this RAM will be lower than what was tested. As for yours ken, what brand are you running? I don't think you stated that earlier.

it's the "OCZ EL plat rev2" TCCD 2,2,2,5

I know TCCD can reach upto and over 300 with 2.5,3,4,5 or so
Just that you said

That's what I like about OCZ, they have TCCD chips, so you know they can take some juice and much lower latencies than rated.

Did you mean that their rated for ddr500 and can run low latencies @ ddr400?
mine can do ddr400 @ 2,2,2,5 with 2.5v
If i crank upto 2.85v i can get upto ddr440 @ 2,2,2,5
If i had more vdimm could i go higher with low latencies?
I'm not going to run out an get a voltmeter and do a mod or get a ddr booster to find out - just curious?
I've read over on madshrimps that early TCCD is best?
I'm hoping it is as when i swith to an AMD X2 setup i can still use this RAM ;)

killswitch83 · Post by **killswitch83** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 10:26 am

I believe early TCCD is more stable, but I'm not exactly sure. Also, keep in mind certain mobo's can limit how much you OC your memory, in addition to whatever the TCCD limits are. and like infinitevalence was saying, you can get higher frequencies by loosening your latency, not sure if you have to raise vdimm due to the frequency increase or not, gotta do some more research. All I know is I'm impressed with the fact that OCZ plat. rev 2 can reach DDR 557, and I plan on running 1 GB dual-channel with this memory (512*2). What do you have for a motherboard?

kenc51 · Post by **kenc51** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 10:33 am

killswitch83 wrote:I believe early TCCD is more stable, but I'm not exactly sure. Also, keep in mind certain mobo's can limit how much you OC your memory, in addition to whatever the TCCD limits are. and like infinitevalence was saying, you can get higher frequencies by loosening your latency, not sure if you have to raise vdimm due to the frequency increase or not, gotta do some more research. All I know is I'm impressed with the fact that OCZ plat. rev 2 can reach DDR 557, and I plan on running 1 GB dual-channel with this memory (512*2). What do you have for a motherboard?

Specs
P4 3.0E @ 3.75 - 1.425v (max is 3.8 but needs 1.5v)
OCZ plat rev2 @ ddr500 2.2.2.5 (2.65v)
p4p800-e dlx
neopower 480
x800pro -> bios mod to XTPE
All water cooled with dual rad

killswitch83 · Post by **killswitch83** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 10:49 am

Nice set of specs there ken. So you've had success with low latencies at DDR 500.....not bad considering you're working with an Asus board, although some Asus boards surprise people with their OC performance. Considering the research I've read and numerous favoring reviews, I would still recommend DFI's Lanparty UT NF4 Ultra-D. They are touted as a high-performance mobo, and a superb overclocker, both CPU and memory. Just ask the mods and admins, I see they favor DFI for performance as well. Of course, they run kinda high, at around 135 bucks, but well worth it if you're going to have a high-performance rig. I've already estimated the cost of my rig, which will be air-cooled by the Thermalright XP-120, at around 1500-1600 bucks. What can I say, I'm a techie freak, lol.

Here's what's in store for me:

Athlon 64 3700+ San Diego (1 MB L2) 90 nm Rev. E
1 GB OCZ Platinum EL rev. 2 dual channel (512 * 2)
Maxtor SATA 300GB with NCQ (may go up to 4 of these drives)
DFI Lanparty UT NF4 Ultra-D
Thermalright XP-120 with AS 5
Thermaltake Tsunami Dream (Silver finish)
OCZ PowerStream 600W

I am still undecided on my video card, though I know for the price, I am planning on going with either a 6800 GT (OC'd to Ultra) or an actual 6800 Ultra, I don't know yet (I can't afford the 7800GTX at 500+ dollars). I also plan on going with either a Coolermaster Aerogate II or Cooldrive 4 thermal monitor. Any recommendations on which manufacturer I should go with? I thought about MSI, considering the software package is immense, and the card is pretty awesome too.

kenc51 · Post by **kenc51** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 11:14 am

First off, I have a Coolermaster Aerogate II, and both temp sensors are about 5-7 deg off!

I personally would get the GT and OC to an Ultra!
The money you save could go on the cpu!
I always find you can cut corners, save a little here and spend a little there!
Buy OEM drives etc. Buy your cpu OEM too.

I haven't read up too much on GFX card packages, since i got mine (no need to really)
I'm not sure about which manufacturer to go for, MSI have always had a great bundle. I find (@ least in Ireland), MSI are way more expensive.
What about XFX? They seem to easily reach Ultra speeds!
also come in a nice box

Gainward come OC'd, but have 2 fans and are louder. Not sure if you can get them in the states? Their "powerpack" cards have fastter than spec ram and the gpu's can OC further. Sure gainward have watercooled sli Ultras available

Man, Your specs are NICE

I'm not going to upgrade until my current card is outdated (agp)
I have this system about 6mths, and is still able to keep up with most
If i buy a new CPU, i have to upgrade mobo/gfx aswell

I'll wait and get an AMD X2 or something when they move to ddr2

killswitch83 · Post by **killswitch83** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 11:43 am

I think I will consider XFX, I know people who have used their cards in the past and found them to be pretty stable for the price, even OC'd. I've found that the best way to get the system you want without breaking the bank right away is to buy parts as you go, granted you have a good-running system already. Whenever you go to upgrade, I believe you will be greatly rewarded by getting the dual core Athlon 64. They stomp on P4's, chew them up, and spit them out when it comes to the majority of benchmarking, real-life simulations, and most definitely gaming. I've read up on the 4800+, which is the baddest of them all, and it makes my wallet scream for it, lol. I've read that you could do DivX encoding and play HL2 or Doom 3 at high detail and resolution, all without as much as a hiccup or choppiness. Even the 840 EE is having a hard time keeping up with the 4800+ in terms of gaming. They also OC real well, with not much of a change in temp (depending on the cooling you have, which water-cooling will definitely help, you might see a 3-5*C rise in temp if I can remember correctly, forgot what it was OC'd to). but, the 3800+ will work just as well and they also yield nice overclocks

. And the good thing is, if you get the DFI board that I'm getting, all you gotta do is update the BIOS and, presto, you can run dual-core!! Whereas with Intel, since the chipsets are different between the single and dual-core processors, you would have to switch mobo's, and on top of that, the lower level Intel dual-cores don't support HTT, but low-end Athlon 64 X2's do, and the funny thing is that Intel was the first to bring out HTT!! Sorry to write so much, but I just find it funny that AMD is crushing Intel in terms of performance, price, reliability, and specs for the money

kenc51 · Post by **kenc51** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:02 pm

AMD don't have Hyperthreading!
Sure you have that correct? HTT is your FSB with amd?
sine amd is dual core it can run 2 seperate threads, intel kinda can do this with the p4.
With the pendium D - it has no hyperthreading, the top model does, so windows thinks it has 4 cpu's (2 real and 2 logical)

AMD X* - windows see 2 REAL cpu's - there are no and never was any logical cpu with amd (hyperthreading)

With the DFI board, when/if i get 1 (remember this prob won't be till next year!), wouldn't it have an updated bios already supporting dual core?

Don't forget ATI's new offering, it can supply 4v vdimm! gets upto 300HTT
and has a bios as tweakable as DFI's offering. Check out the review over on anandtech

But yes your right, AMD ROCKS at the moment
Intel have nothing to compair. except their dothan, which is faster than amd clock for clock (not dual core till codenamed "Napa" is released)

gvblake22 · Post by **gvblake22** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:09 pm

[quote="kenc51Specs
P4 3.0E @ 3.75 - 1.425v (max is 3.8 but needs 1.5v)
OCZ plat rev2 @ ddr500 2.2.2.5 (2.65v)
p4p800-e dlx
neopower 480
x800pro -> bios mod to XTPE
All water cooled with dual rad[/quote]
Are you really running that OCZ Platinum rev. 2 at 250mhz at 2-2-2-5?? I'd like to see a screenshot of this.

kenc51 · Post by **kenc51** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:36 pm

sh1t

, sorry didn't notice that!
NO - running 2.5,3,3,5

sorry about that

killswitch83 · Post by **killswitch83** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:39 pm

I just noticed my mistake too, lol, my bad, forgot it saw two true CPU's; as far as coming with an updated BIOS, it may by the time you get around to upgrading, but DFI also has a performance BIOS on their site, and will probably release more, thus another reason to update it.

gvblake22 · Post by **gvblake22** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:46 pm

kenc51 wrote:sh1t , sorry didn't notice that!
NO - running 2.5,3,3,5

sorry about that

HAHAHA, that looks a little better

Is that the stuff with TCCD or TCC5?

And I think even the most recent DFI boards right now should be shipping with a Dual Core compatable BIOS, so I wouldn't be worried, they've got thier $chiznat together over there

kenc51 · Post by **kenc51** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:47 pm

of course
was thinking more about my first boot!
I always planned to update the bios, i heard the "official" bios is crap for overclocking

But by then there could be Nforce5 chipset
supposedly amd will switch to ddr2 next year, doubt it as will prob be early '07

kenc51 · Post by **kenc51** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:49 pm

gvblake22 wrote:
kenc51 wrote:sh1t , sorry didn't notice that!
NO - running 2.5,3,3,5

sorry about that
HAHAHA, that looks a little better
Is that the stuff with TCCD or TCC5?

VERY early TCCD
I know because i got it july last year!!
Anandtech was the first site is saw a review on this stuff,
ORDERED THE NEXT DAY

Which is better?
TCC5 is later yes?

killswitch83 · Post by **killswitch83** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:51 pm

Wow, seems like blake's ever the master of slacking off, heheh, you better make that 3 dollars an hour

gvblake22 · Post by **gvblake22** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:56 pm

killswitch83 wrote:Wow, seems like blake's ever the master of slacking off, heheh, you better make that 3 dollars an hour

HAHAHA, yeah, I figure for $3 an hour I can afford to slack off a little. They obviously don't think that highly of me

*cough*damn intern*COUGH* grumble grumble.................... . . . . . . . . .

Anyway, yeah, TCC5 is what is shipping now. You should be able to tell if it's TCCD or TCC5 by looking at the sticker on the heatspreader. There is a little tiny v1.1 or v1.2 or something like that on the modules that have TCC5 and there will be nothing on the modules with TCCD.
Most all of them are shipping with TCC5 now I believe. Some have still gotten great clocks out of their TCC5 sticks while others say that TCC5 is infact inferior to TCCD unless it is binned as faster speed (like the OCZ Platinum PC-4800 and PC-5000 which has TCC5).

gvblake22 · Post by **gvblake22** » Wed Aug 03, 2005 1:01 pm

kenc51 wrote:of course
was thinking more about my first boot!
I always planned to update the bios, i heard the "official" bios is crap for overclocking

But by then there could be Nforce5 chipset
supposedly amd will switch to ddr2 next year, doubt it as will prob be early '07

I dunno, I think Socket M2 (with DDR2) will probably be out before the end of 2006.
http://www.c627627.com/AMD/Athlon64/