I'm new to overclocking, and I would like to take a shot at it before I purchase the 6400x2. I have ballistix 2.2v ram, the 5600 and a 3870 gpu. Do I just bump up the front side bus? What downloads are there for me to see the results? Would like to go to 3.0 on clock. Also have a seagate 500gig, 32mb cache hdd if that matters. Thanks in advance for any info.
M3A
Amd 5600x2
crucial ballistix 2x1gig
seagate hd
Antec 900 case
Gecube 3870
a dvd thing from liteon
a power supply
some kind of bird in a pear tree.
M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
I run the M3A with the X2 6400 it runs pretty good, but with some tweaking you should be able to get performance pretty close to it from the 5600.
Make sure you have the AMD processor driver and AMD Dual core optimizer installed (if you don't you can get them over on the AMD site) If you don't have the Processor driver loaded the stability tests will usually show it as unstable, if you don't have the dual core optimizer loaded you get unbalanced loads on the two cores.
Programs: OCCT for stability testing, CPU-Z to see the memory timings, CPU speed etc. AMD OverDrive will show you core temps, voltages, and a bunch more stuff but the Auto Over clocker doesn't work with the X2 on this board. There are a lot more OC utilities out there if you want to find a guide listing the dozen or so commonly used. I mainly use those three. AMD Overdrive seems really accurate for temps and voltages provided your using the latest bios 0601. There's a link to that bios in my thread in the AMD motherboard section. (M3A motherboard upgrade "Swamp Thing" on like page 6)
Start by bumping the FSB (called Hyper Transport on AMD, still amusingly called FSB in the asus bios) up to 220 save settings and try for a post/boot. If you get a successful boot into windows, load OCCT, it'll show you the FSB speed, cpu speed etc on the load screen. Load AMD overdrive and go to the Monitor system screen (I'm on my laptop so I can't tell you exactly which to go to), your looking for the screen that shows you CPU core temperatures. With that screen up move OCCT over so the two programs are visible side by side.
Run OCCT stress CPU and Memory for like 20 minutes, if it runs stable you can bump the fsb up by 5 each time retest until it tests unstable or BSOD. (Blue screen of death) When it gets unstable you can up the vcore voltage 1 notch reboot and retest stability. Keep repeating that process until you get the OC you want.
If you don't get a successful boot try loosening the timings on your ram, IE: if their 4-4-4-12 try booting at 5-5-5-15 (or 18). If the timings are to tight they can prevent a boot at OC speeds. You can also try increasing the ram voltage 1 notch before loosening. By stingy with the voltages, run the lowest stable voltages you can, over volting causes excess heat, excess heat shortens the life of components. CPU-Z has a memory timings screen that shows the different timings your ram is rated for. You can run other timings with testing, Ballistics is pretty good ram.
Keep an eye on the CPU temps, the operating temps on that CPU should be 41C to 71C and under no circumstances would I allow it to operate above 55C for any length of time. I don't like mine to get over 50C ever for any reason. I've used that standard on my X2 3800, 4200, and 6400 and haven't killed a core yet.
Keep in mind temperatures exceeding the operational guidelines can cause your CPU to die in 3 or 4 seconds, so don't exceed 55 (that allows for incorrect readings). That also means don't walk away to play with the cat for a half hour while OCCT runs. You may have to use an after market cooler if you get uncomfortable temps.
Give those things a shot and gives you any guff come back and report what happened and we'll go from there.
Make sure you have the AMD processor driver and AMD Dual core optimizer installed (if you don't you can get them over on the AMD site) If you don't have the Processor driver loaded the stability tests will usually show it as unstable, if you don't have the dual core optimizer loaded you get unbalanced loads on the two cores.
Programs: OCCT for stability testing, CPU-Z to see the memory timings, CPU speed etc. AMD OverDrive will show you core temps, voltages, and a bunch more stuff but the Auto Over clocker doesn't work with the X2 on this board. There are a lot more OC utilities out there if you want to find a guide listing the dozen or so commonly used. I mainly use those three. AMD Overdrive seems really accurate for temps and voltages provided your using the latest bios 0601. There's a link to that bios in my thread in the AMD motherboard section. (M3A motherboard upgrade "Swamp Thing" on like page 6)
Start by bumping the FSB (called Hyper Transport on AMD, still amusingly called FSB in the asus bios) up to 220 save settings and try for a post/boot. If you get a successful boot into windows, load OCCT, it'll show you the FSB speed, cpu speed etc on the load screen. Load AMD overdrive and go to the Monitor system screen (I'm on my laptop so I can't tell you exactly which to go to), your looking for the screen that shows you CPU core temperatures. With that screen up move OCCT over so the two programs are visible side by side.
Run OCCT stress CPU and Memory for like 20 minutes, if it runs stable you can bump the fsb up by 5 each time retest until it tests unstable or BSOD. (Blue screen of death) When it gets unstable you can up the vcore voltage 1 notch reboot and retest stability. Keep repeating that process until you get the OC you want.
If you don't get a successful boot try loosening the timings on your ram, IE: if their 4-4-4-12 try booting at 5-5-5-15 (or 18). If the timings are to tight they can prevent a boot at OC speeds. You can also try increasing the ram voltage 1 notch before loosening. By stingy with the voltages, run the lowest stable voltages you can, over volting causes excess heat, excess heat shortens the life of components. CPU-Z has a memory timings screen that shows the different timings your ram is rated for. You can run other timings with testing, Ballistics is pretty good ram.
Keep an eye on the CPU temps, the operating temps on that CPU should be 41C to 71C and under no circumstances would I allow it to operate above 55C for any length of time. I don't like mine to get over 50C ever for any reason. I've used that standard on my X2 3800, 4200, and 6400 and haven't killed a core yet.
Keep in mind temperatures exceeding the operational guidelines can cause your CPU to die in 3 or 4 seconds, so don't exceed 55 (that allows for incorrect readings). That also means don't walk away to play with the cat for a half hour while OCCT runs. You may have to use an after market cooler if you get uncomfortable temps.
Give those things a shot and gives you any guff come back and report what happened and we'll go from there.
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
Ok, Thanks alot Methious. The best detail I've ever read and now I can sit back with that info and play around for a while. I want to learn on this 5600 so I have an excuse to get the 6400 if I mess it up. Then again from what you just stated I might just be satisfied for awhile if it can do what you stated. I have the bus up to 210 now, almost 3.0, nothing else has been increased. I got the ballistx because I heard that the type of ram would be a factor. Reviews stated some have theirs running 900 after overclock with these sticks. I'll go look at zalmans tonight. You have a suggestion for this motherboard? Thanks again.
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
One thing I forgot, if it starts buckling on you (Reboot/Bsod) you can lower the HT setting in bios from 1GHZ to 800MHZ (5x to 4x essentially), when you get to playing with the ram, I've had my OCZ Reaper 800mhz up to 1068mhz stable @ 2.2v. Not that I'd run it that high 24/7.
Once you get your stable OC, record the settings (I'm lazy I take a digital photo of the bios pages)
Lower your cpu multiplier by 1 notch, then increase the FSB higher to OC the ram farther. You can kind of figure your projected speed by doing some simple math. Take the CPU Multiplier, multiply it by the fsb (11x multiplier, FSB 211 would give a cpu speed of 11X211= 2.32GHZ).
So drop the cpu multiplier by one, multiply that number by FSB speeds until you get back to stock cpu speed (on a calculator), might have to go up one on vcore and one on ram voltage (try without first) then save and boot into windows. Load CPU-Z and click the tab for memory, you'll see as the FSB speed increases ram speed increases too. That's where you might have to loosen the ram timings, I'd try for a good balance of cpu over clock/ram over clock with out having to loosen the ram timings. If you can hit that sweet spot, tight timings, decent cpu OC you'll get the best performance there.
The reason for that is as you loosen timings the ram is more inefficient, say if you leave the cpu at stock speed, and run a test like Sisoft Sandra on the memory and get a score of 9800, then loosen the timings one notch run the test again you'll get a lower score. Now you can crank up the FSB and lower the multiplier with the loosened timings and get that back by going high enough, but hit 3.0/3.1/3.2 with the tight timings and it's better.
Drop in and let us know what you get.
Once you get your stable OC, record the settings (I'm lazy I take a digital photo of the bios pages)
Lower your cpu multiplier by 1 notch, then increase the FSB higher to OC the ram farther. You can kind of figure your projected speed by doing some simple math. Take the CPU Multiplier, multiply it by the fsb (11x multiplier, FSB 211 would give a cpu speed of 11X211= 2.32GHZ).
So drop the cpu multiplier by one, multiply that number by FSB speeds until you get back to stock cpu speed (on a calculator), might have to go up one on vcore and one on ram voltage (try without first) then save and boot into windows. Load CPU-Z and click the tab for memory, you'll see as the FSB speed increases ram speed increases too. That's where you might have to loosen the ram timings, I'd try for a good balance of cpu over clock/ram over clock with out having to loosen the ram timings. If you can hit that sweet spot, tight timings, decent cpu OC you'll get the best performance there.
The reason for that is as you loosen timings the ram is more inefficient, say if you leave the cpu at stock speed, and run a test like Sisoft Sandra on the memory and get a score of 9800, then loosen the timings one notch run the test again you'll get a lower score. Now you can crank up the FSB and lower the multiplier with the loosened timings and get that back by going high enough, but hit 3.0/3.1/3.2 with the tight timings and it's better.
Drop in and let us know what you get.
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
Well Methious, with just taking the fsb up to 219 it gives me 3.06 on the chip. I dwnld'd cpu-z and that's shows ram at 5-5-5-18-?-2t. Also up'd my vista rating from 5.3 to 5.5. This is very interesting. Is there anyway you can get some pic's up on your bios settings, or know of any others are using? Temps have'nt moved, still around 20-22c. I'm looking at them now and it flashes from 17-22 on stock cooler.
Bios is a little confusing. At least it tells me to go back and change things I messed up. The 3870 comes with overdrive, which allows me to ovrclk the gpu, should I do anything in bios on the pci-e part? I've read some have theirs at 1100, not sure if that's 110 in bios or what.
On the Amd site it stated the amd chip driver was for Xp and server 2003. I could'nt download the other because I'm missing something, and was wondering if
the driver was the reason. Thanks again for your help, I'm now begining to see that this chip can go a little more. I'll try for 3.1 here in the next day or two, and that will most likely include a vcore increase of 1. If I get it that high I'll stop most likely. Later
Bios is a little confusing. At least it tells me to go back and change things I messed up. The 3870 comes with overdrive, which allows me to ovrclk the gpu, should I do anything in bios on the pci-e part? I've read some have theirs at 1100, not sure if that's 110 in bios or what.
On the Amd site it stated the amd chip driver was for Xp and server 2003. I could'nt download the other because I'm missing something, and was wondering if
the driver was the reason. Thanks again for your help, I'm now begining to see that this chip can go a little more. I'll try for 3.1 here in the next day or two, and that will most likely include a vcore increase of 1. If I get it that high I'll stop most likely. Later
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
I'm running an X2 6400 so my bios setting won't help with a 5600. The 6400 doesn't have a lot of head room for OC, with it all I have to do is up the FSB to 220, drop HT to 800mhz, and depending on ram loosen timings and I'm up to 3.52. Each OC is different, each CPU chip, memory chip machine OCs differently. So were stuck with learning the methodology of OC and stability testing. The higher you OC the harder it gets as other voltages may have to increase.
I wouldn't mess with the PCIE settings I've ran the settings on mine and you don't get much from changing the settings there.
Post up the exact ram kit you have (model number) and I can check it's timings. 5-5-5-18 (or 15) is a common setting for ram. This board doesn't do the best job of detecting the SPD settings so those timings might be off a little.
For a first OC you picked it up pretty good. Your using Vista, I missed that. You shouldn't need a processor driver for Vista, later on they might come up with one but it's probably built into Vista for now.
I wouldn't mess with the PCIE settings I've ran the settings on mine and you don't get much from changing the settings there.
Post up the exact ram kit you have (model number) and I can check it's timings. 5-5-5-18 (or 15) is a common setting for ram. This board doesn't do the best job of detecting the SPD settings so those timings might be off a little.
For a first OC you picked it up pretty good. Your using Vista, I missed that. You shouldn't need a processor driver for Vista, later on they might come up with one but it's probably built into Vista for now.
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
Ram model# is BL2KIT12864AA804 . I got it to 3.1! What a deal! I had to increase cpu volts to 1.35 (max spec's) to do it. Had it at 225 fsb but locked up on me typing you a message. I have it at 223 now. Cpu temp under 33, 33 being max at startup and getting on the net, drops to 23 after. Cpu volts only show 1.325, and I tried that but board would'nt let me boot until I put it at 1.35. I have a 2mb flash stick but unsure of how to download my current bios. Do I put them in a file on windows and then download them?
Anyway, I can't go higher on fsb without issues, I've up'd the volts on cpu to get here. Now what's next?
Once again I thank you for getting me this far! This is great, and I'm worried that I'll have a permanent smile on my face!
When I get my 6400x2 (if I want it now) I'll be sure to look you up. This wednesday I'll be getting a sataII dvd. I have an IDE now, thinking I would need the sata's(since there are only 4). I first built with a raid 0 and that sucked, but now I have that 500gig/32mb cache hdd and that makes a world of difference! I want to overclock this and add that dvd and compare what used to be. So far without overclock, this hdd and vista works great. With overclock I can see a change, but I should see it greatly with the dvd and downloading....I hope.Thoughtz?
Timing's at 5-5-5-18-24-2T
Do you use vista? If so, what is your rating for that overclocked 6400? I'm wondering just what it takes to get a 5.9 out of vista.
Late!
Anyway, I can't go higher on fsb without issues, I've up'd the volts on cpu to get here. Now what's next?
Once again I thank you for getting me this far! This is great, and I'm worried that I'll have a permanent smile on my face!
When I get my 6400x2 (if I want it now) I'll be sure to look you up. This wednesday I'll be getting a sataII dvd. I have an IDE now, thinking I would need the sata's(since there are only 4). I first built with a raid 0 and that sucked, but now I have that 500gig/32mb cache hdd and that makes a world of difference! I want to overclock this and add that dvd and compare what used to be. So far without overclock, this hdd and vista works great. With overclock I can see a change, but I should see it greatly with the dvd and downloading....I hope.Thoughtz?
Timing's at 5-5-5-18-24-2T
Do you use vista? If so, what is your rating for that overclocked 6400? I'm wondering just what it takes to get a 5.9 out of vista.
Late!
Last edited by jusme on Sun Feb 24, 2008 10:56 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
Cpu-z showing 3.122.......whee
Vista score still 5.5
I just got my 3dmark06 score.....11810! I'm not kidding! WOW! With a radeon 3870? I'll take that! Late
Vista score still 5.5
I just got my 3dmark06 score.....11810! I'm not kidding! WOW! With a radeon 3870? I'll take that! Late
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
Some times I run Vista but not as my primary OS, it was a 5.7 before I put in the OCZ Reaper 4 gig kit, went to 5.8 after. Your kit is listed below, did you relax the timings yourself or did the board read them that way? Your running at 5-5-5-18 and default is 4-4-4-12 @ 2.2v, Asus over volts ram by .06v so 2.15 probably run it fine.
Going above 225 FSB is probably a ram thing, as the FSB speed increases so does the ram speed, try and get it to post with the 4-4-4-12 trc auto @ 2.15v or 2.2v if it doesn't post try 4-4-4-15 trc 20. If you get a stable post at 4-4-4-XX @ 2.25v or under I'd hold there. That CPU speed and those timings would be awesome. If you can't get 4-4-4-XX try 5-5-5-15 trc 21.
To go any higher fsb you'd probably have to loosen ram timings, and no more speed than you'd get (.1 ghz) the loosened timings would negate the speed increase. That Cpu/Ram OC balance I was talking about.
2GB kit (1GBx2), Ballistix 240-pin DIMM, DDR2 PC2-6400 memory module
BL2KIT12864AA804
US $79.99
* Module Size: 2GB kit (1GBx2)
* Package: Ballistix 240-pin DIMM
* Feature: DDR2 PC2-6400
* Specs: DDR2 PC2-6400 • 4-4-4-12 • Unbuffered • NON-ECC • DDR2-800 • 2.2V • SLI-Ready • 128Meg x 64
Going above 225 FSB is probably a ram thing, as the FSB speed increases so does the ram speed, try and get it to post with the 4-4-4-12 trc auto @ 2.15v or 2.2v if it doesn't post try 4-4-4-15 trc 20. If you get a stable post at 4-4-4-XX @ 2.25v or under I'd hold there. That CPU speed and those timings would be awesome. If you can't get 4-4-4-XX try 5-5-5-15 trc 21.
To go any higher fsb you'd probably have to loosen ram timings, and no more speed than you'd get (.1 ghz) the loosened timings would negate the speed increase. That Cpu/Ram OC balance I was talking about.
2GB kit (1GBx2), Ballistix 240-pin DIMM, DDR2 PC2-6400 memory module
BL2KIT12864AA804
US $79.99
* Module Size: 2GB kit (1GBx2)
* Package: Ballistix 240-pin DIMM
* Feature: DDR2 PC2-6400
* Specs: DDR2 PC2-6400 • 4-4-4-12 • Unbuffered • NON-ECC • DDR2-800 • 2.2V • SLI-Ready • 128Meg x 64
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
Forgot, if your at 3.1 stable it's probably not worth it to go to the 6400. The 6400 is a 90nm cpu, the increased size (from 65nm to 90nm) makes it a heat pump. It runs great don't get me wrong, but it takes a huge air cooler (zalman 9700, thermalright ultra 120) to keep it cool. I went to water cooling, the thermalright was doing it good, but I wanted water for future builds.
Then on the 6400 you might get 3.52. It's a much harder OC to get right, heat increases exponentially as speed increases, and the $150 for the slightly faster cpu would be better saved for another build. It also doesn't come with a heat sink, and the 5600 heat sink won't do it. That increases the real cost by 60-70 bucks.
You get to that point might as well hit up an Intel rig.
The dvd Sata drive will work, but when you install it you'll see it's read as a possible raid drive if you have the raid drivers installed and the controller set to raid. It's not a big deal, takes a second longer to boot windows still reads it right and uses it and it's still bootable. If it's set to IDE mode probably won't even notice.
Then on the 6400 you might get 3.52. It's a much harder OC to get right, heat increases exponentially as speed increases, and the $150 for the slightly faster cpu would be better saved for another build. It also doesn't come with a heat sink, and the 5600 heat sink won't do it. That increases the real cost by 60-70 bucks.
You get to that point might as well hit up an Intel rig.
The dvd Sata drive will work, but when you install it you'll see it's read as a possible raid drive if you have the raid drivers installed and the controller set to raid. It's not a big deal, takes a second longer to boot windows still reads it right and uses it and it's still bootable. If it's set to IDE mode probably won't even notice.
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
Ok, I got the timings to work, 4-4-4-12 @ 2.20v. Will 225 work on fsb now? I'll check it out later tonight. Speaking of 6400 price and hs/f, I priced a new build using both platfroms and the difference was only $100. Amd boards were more expensive and the intel chip was more expensive. They offset each other and kept the price near exact(intel priced with 1066 ram). That's todays prices, when I built this it was $500 more for intel and I wanted the e6750 for that. E6600 or 50 was'nt that much less. I'll have to build my son a computer for college this next winter, so it'll give Amd time to get quads up and running and working very well, or I'll go for the intel extreme, he'll need graphics and calculation power.
The timings I wrote earlier were done by motherboards auto pilot. These I have now I put in manually...of course. The part you stated to put on auto is set to auto. Cpu-z shows 4-4-4-12-24-2t. Chip at 3.122. HT link 1115. Dram freq 446. Just tried 225 fsb, still does'nt work, vista locked up b4 desktop.
I'm glad I'm using this heavy arse Antec 900....I think it's all that's holding my house down in this dam wind.
The timings I wrote earlier were done by motherboards auto pilot. These I have now I put in manually...of course. The part you stated to put on auto is set to auto. Cpu-z shows 4-4-4-12-24-2t. Chip at 3.122. HT link 1115. Dram freq 446. Just tried 225 fsb, still does'nt work, vista locked up b4 desktop.
I'm glad I'm using this heavy arse Antec 900....I think it's all that's holding my house down in this dam wind.
Last edited by jusme on Mon Feb 25, 2008 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
I ran 3dmark06 again and it came out to 11817....that sound right? That's what it stated online after running it. Whee. When you go online to view results it states "n/a" 3dmark or something like that. Oh well, the guys above me with same gpu and using athlonx2's have the 6000 or 6400. they range in the 12000 to mid 13000 range. Best thing that happened was my rig crashed. I upgraded memory and hdd and I learned how to overclock and this is what it got me. Thanks Methious! Very Respectable considering what I was getting b4 crash,......*yuck*.
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
Glad to help.
That's what I was telling you, if you can get 4-4-4-anything and run at 3.1X that's sweet. To go any higher on the fsb you'd have to loosen timings, it's not worth it to loosen timings to get 100 MHZ more. Your rams at almost 900, cpu @ 3.1 and got tight timings. That's a sweet spot. When you hit the sweet spot stay in it and bask in it's glow.
I'll be back tomorrow I'm building into a new full tower and leak testing right now. Congrats!
That's what I was telling you, if you can get 4-4-4-anything and run at 3.1X that's sweet. To go any higher on the fsb you'd have to loosen timings, it's not worth it to loosen timings to get 100 MHZ more. Your rams at almost 900, cpu @ 3.1 and got tight timings. That's a sweet spot. When you hit the sweet spot stay in it and bask in it's glow.
I'll be back tomorrow I'm building into a new full tower and leak testing right now. Congrats!
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
I saw some corsiar ram that people are stating have D9 blah blah blah chips. If I got that would it help the overclock remain stable or help with overclocking period? $159, hope it does something different.Thx
Re: M3A/ athlon 5600x2 overclock
Crucial Ballistix should be Micron D9 memory, unless the lack of coffee this morning has clouded my head Crucial is a division of Micron. Even with a X2 5000 Black Edition you be hard pressed to get more than you have now.
You can probably get more by loosening timings on the ram, if you just want to see how far you can go, fire up CPU-Z and look at the memory tab and loosen the timings to one of the stock SPD timings.
Then lower the Hyper transport link (should be on 800mhz now if you already lowered it) but to go higher lower it to 600mhz. Probably have to bump cpu voltages up one or two, ram voltage up 1, maybe SB (South Bridge) voltage one. Then increase the OC, when you get that stable go in and reduce individual voltages to find out the minimum needed.
When your reading the Hyper Transport speed it shouldn't go over 1100ish. Much higher causes to many stability problems. That's why as you increase the Oc you have to lower it.
You can probably get more by loosening timings on the ram, if you just want to see how far you can go, fire up CPU-Z and look at the memory tab and loosen the timings to one of the stock SPD timings.
Then lower the Hyper transport link (should be on 800mhz now if you already lowered it) but to go higher lower it to 600mhz. Probably have to bump cpu voltages up one or two, ram voltage up 1, maybe SB (South Bridge) voltage one. Then increase the OC, when you get that stable go in and reduce individual voltages to find out the minimum needed.
When your reading the Hyper Transport speed it shouldn't go over 1100ish. Much higher causes to many stability problems. That's why as you increase the Oc you have to lower it.