Sneak Peak - Ultra Products 2000W ATX Power Supply

SAMSAMHA · Post by **SAMSAMHA** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 2:39 am

wow 2kw, it's nice that it's not priced too extreme and it's not super duper huge. Though 2kw, mmh, why would you need this. I guess maybe for the 20 HDs, and dual quad core, dual sli:)

jonnyGURU · Post by **jonnyGURU** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 9:54 am

I might have said this before, but A 2000W POWER SUPPLY DOES NOT PUT OUT 2000W OF POWER UNLESS IT HAS A 2000W LOAD!

I keep hearing "this thing is going to trip breakers."

Umm.... If this thing is loaded to the point where it's going to trip a breaker, than ANY OTHER POWER SUPPLY ON THE MARKET is going to completely shut down anyways!

It's fun to read all of these replies and opinions, but people really need to think it through. ;)

Also, the concept of rail distribution seems to escape some people. If most PSU's draw 400W, why do we need 600W? Because most of the load is on the 12V rail and the 12V capability of a power supply is typically not even 80% of the power supply's total capability.

Good example:

I have a quad father (the dual FX72's like the one in Nate's photo) with a pair of 8800GTS cards in it. With ANY 600W PSU, the PC won't boot up. It will post, but once the hard drive kicks in, the machine locks up tight as a drum. If I use at least a 700W PSU, it'll boot right up and run with no problems. Yet when I plug it into a device used to measure power draw from the wall (similar to a Kill-A-Watt or Seasoic Power Angel) I only measure a 500W draw from the wall while running 3DMark 2006. Yet a 600W PSU won't even let it boot up? Hmmm..... ;)

Post by **Apoptosis** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 12:28 pm

jonnyGURU wrote: I have a quad father (the dual FX72's like the one in Nate's photo) with a pair of 8800GTS cards in it. With ANY 600W PSU, the PC won't boot up. It will post, but once the hard drive kicks in, the machine locks up tight as a drum. If I use at least a 700W PSU, it'll boot right up and run with no problems. Yet when I plug it into a device used to measure power draw from the wall (similar to a Kill-A-Watt or Seasoic Power Angel) I only measure a 500W draw from the wall while running 3DMark 2006. Yet a 600W PSU won't even let it boot up? Hmmm..... ;)

I was running dual FX74's, dual 8800GTX's, and overclocking the CPU 200Mhz, so I now exactly what you mean with lesser PSU's ;)

SAMSAMHA · Post by **SAMSAMHA** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 1:38 pm

I think having a higher wattage psu just give a mind at ease when you upgrade. Still the quality usually is more important than numbers, which some people didn't consider.

eva2000 · Post by **eva2000** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 12:15 pm

maybe it's for quad R600

bubba · Post by **bubba** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 2:19 pm

jonnyGURU wrote: Also, the concept of rail distribution seems to escape some people.

yep, I'm looking around on how these things really work, I have a vague idea now, but I truly still don't understand how they work yet.

dgood · Post by **dgood** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 9:07 pm

I think i'd have to give up on computer gaming and such if they don't learn to get more efficiency from the power they are already using I've got my 500watt and I don't think anything over 650watts should ever be necessary they should just make parts that take less power and don't just brag about higher performance if really it just means a lot more power.

ikjadoon · Post by **ikjadoon** » Fri Jan 12, 2007 6:07 pm

Damn.

That is nice, Ultra. Very nice. Modular, too? Freaking amazing.

Quick question about efficiency: Say you have a 500W PSU. It has a mediocre 70% efficiency rating. For the purposes of this question, it will always have a 70% efficiency rating, no matter the load. So that means only 350W of power will be available for the system to use?

~Ibrahim~

Post by **dicecca112** » Fri Jan 12, 2007 6:15 pm

No that's not right.

What is efficiency in a power supply? It is defined as the power loss in AC-to-DC conversion, expressed as a percentage of total AC input power. For example, a power supply that requires 100W AC input to produce 70W DC output has an efficiency of 70%. In this example, 30W is lost as heat within the PSU. A power supply that requires 100W AC input to produce 80W DC output has an efficiency of 80%. 20W is lost as heat. The 10W difference in these examples seems trivial. However, at higher output levels, differences in efficiency becomes quite significant in terms of how much energy is lost as heat, as the table below shows. The ideal efficiency is 100%, where AC input and DC output are the same, and there is no loss to heat in the power supply.

There is 500W available but the PSU has to pull 30% more than that to get that 500W. So say you want 500W, it pulls 650W, the 150W extra is lost as heat.

The higher the efficiency the lower your power bill will be as well.

ikjadoon · Post by **ikjadoon** » Fri Jan 12, 2007 7:46 pm

Ohhh. So, even if it had a 50% efficiency rating, I'd still get my 500W?

But it would need to take in 1000W and somehow dissipate 500W of heat.

~Ibrahim~

Post by **dicecca112** » Fri Jan 12, 2007 9:03 pm

if I understand correctly, which I believe I do. Yes. Remember its amazing that were up to 80% conversion from AC to DC as it is.

ikjadoon · Post by **ikjadoon** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 3:00 pm

Yeah, 80% is actually really good. I hate to ask another nooby question, but PFC does what? It keeps saying 99% efficiency, is that the same as AC-to-DC conversion?

~Ibrahim~

Post by **dicecca112** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 4:37 pm

from http://www.silentpcreview.com/article28-page5.html

POWER FACTOR CORRECTION

Increasingly, switched mode power supplies (SMPS) are designed with an active power factor correction (PFC) input stage. This is mainly to meet new regulations aimed at restricting the harmonic content of the load current drawn from power lines. Both users and power companies benefit from PFC, as does the environment.

Power Factor Correction (PFC) can be defined as the reduction of the harmonic content, and/or the aligning of the phase angle of incoming current so that it is in phase with the line voltage. Mathematically, Power Factor (PF) is equal to Real Power (Watts) divided by Apparent Power (Volt*Ampere). The basic concept is to make the input look like a pure resistor. Resistors have a power factor of 1 (unity). This allows the power distribution system to operate at maximum efficiency, which reduces energy consumption.

Non-PFC power supplies use a capacitive filter at the AC input. This results in rectification of the AC line, causes high peak currents at the crests of the AC voltage. These peak currents lead to excessive voltage drops in the wiring and imbalance problems in the three-phase power delivery system. The full energy potential of the AC line is not utilized. Nonlinear peak currents also distort output voltage and create harmonics. There is an international standard for controlling harmonics (IEC100-3-2) and PFC is mandatory for home appliances consuming 70W or more power in EU nations as of January, 2001.

PFC circuits are classified into two types: active and passive.

Passive PFC uses passive elements such as a ferrite core inductor on the input source to create a countering reactance. While easily applied to the existing power circuitry without much modification, the power factor is low (60 - 80%), the AC input must be chosen (115VAC / 230VAC), and the harmonics produced from the difference between the capacitance and the inductance are hard to control. Significant electromagnetic noise can result.

Active PFC uses switching regulator technology with active elements such as IC, FET and diodes, to create a PFC circuit This circuit has a theoretical power factor of over 95%, reduces total harmonics noticeably, and automatically adjusts for AC input voltage. However, it requires a complex EMI filter and an input source circuit, and is more costly to build.

Post by **Apoptosis** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 6:26 pm

or to quote something on LR: http://www.legitreviews.com/article/348/11/

The most efficient power supplies have Active Power Factor Correction (Active PFC). Active PFC power supplies use a circuit to correct the power factor, which menas Active PFC power supplies are able to generate a theoretical power factor of over 95%. Active Power Factor Correction also markedly diminishes total harmonics, automatically corrects for AC input voltage, and is capable of a full range of input voltage. Active PFC is the more complex method of Power Factor Correction, so it is more expensive to produce an Active PFC power supply. Non-PFC power supplies are no longer recommended by many system builders and believe it or not, in Europe, power supplies are now required to have either active PFC or passive PFC.

Post by **dicecca112** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 6:32 pm

yeah I haven't seen any non Active PSUs in a while, at least the high end ones

ikjadoon · Post by **ikjadoon** » Sun Jan 14, 2007 5:33 pm

Got it! Thank you both for the information!

~Ibrahim~